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Femi Gbajabiamila is the current minority leader of the House of
Representatives. With the recent increase in the number of minority
parties in the house, Mr Gbajabiamila hopes for more qualitative
legislation.

Do you see yourself coming back as the minority leader?

In politics, you
don’t plan too far ahead because a lot of things can happen but all
things being equal, I should be coming back as the leader of my party
and invariably, the leader of other minority parties as well.

What are those things you would have change if the opposition had more numbers?

Rightly, PDP
(People’s Democratic Party) was like a super majority in the House,
with more than 260 members. So, it was difficult getting anything done.
There is a cliché in the House that, “You can have your say but we will
have our way.” I would love to see a situation where people will be
true to the oath they swore, to do the bidding of Nigerians and not the
wish of a party. With the new trend, I hope that minority parties will
unite because our biggest problem has been lack of cohesion. But if we
can come under one strong umbrella with one voice as opposition, we
will get a lot more done, especially in the area of budgeting because
the majority party, the PDP, must talk to us now.

How will the increase in the rank of the opposition affect the engagement among legislators?

First, the cliché
of ‘You can have your say but we will have our way’ will be a thing of
the past. Nothing will be rammed down our throats anymore and there
will be a lot more lobbying and confrontation. This eventually will
affect the quality of government’s policies and laws. The interest of a
particular party will no longer be supreme; there will be more robust
debate. It will be a House of many colours. Before, there was no rule
of engagement because our number is negligible and they can afford to
ride roughshod over us. It’s all PDP affair. But that will surely
change now. However, for that to change, the opposition must marry its
numbers with unity. If we still have more than one opposition, rather
than one opposition, the swell in number will not make any difference

But some legislators are new in the business; won’t their inexperience affect your work?

We all know that
being a good legislator takes years of training and experience. It is a
serious business. In advanced democracies, you see people who have been
legislators for more than twenty years. Legislation involves a lot of
intrigues and, unfortunately, we are going to suffer for that lack of
experience. However, that case is not peculiar to the opposition alone;
the PDP also has many new comers, who are equally inexperienced. So, it
means those of us with relatively longer experience have a big task of
carrying others along.

If you come
back as the minority leader, do you think you have the mien to unify
Action Congress of Nigeria (ACN) and Congress for Progressive Change
(CPC) legislators, now that the alliance talk has broken down?

First, the alliance
talk has not broken down. It may be a post-election alliance. But we
have been at this effort of having a united opposition and our seed is
beginning to grow. What we have done is to reshuffle the structure of
the opposition in a way that the ACN, which has the highest number of
the opposition members, did not take all the positions. Before, ANPP
(All Nigerian Peoples Party), which was the leading opposition party,
took three of the positions and gave one to ACN. I made sure that each
party is represented. This has paid off in that we now have better
understanding among ourselves and I hope we can continue the trend.

What, exactly, will be the agenda of the opposition members in the House?

I am going to be
pushing for issues that will ensure the growth of our democracy. The
first is the independence of the legislative arm of the government. We
know that gone are the days of ‘rubber stamping’ whatever comes from
the executive arm of government. I will be pushing vigorously for true
federalism where we will have a weaker centre and stronger states. We
have many legislators who do not understand that they do not represent
the federal government. We work at the federal level but we actually
represent our respective states. So, states should actually be
stronger. This will call for further constitutional amendments,
especially the exclusive legislative list. We should not have more than
10 items, at most, on that list. But we have 53 items. Many of our
problems will disappear if we substitute this unitary system of
government for true federalism. Federal government has no business
setting minimum wage for states, for example.

Recently, a
bill to increase VAT rate and reduce that of personal income tax was
mooted. Lagos stands to be the worst victim because it relies heavily
on PAYE, while the VAT it generates goes to the federal government.
What are your thoughts on this?

That is another
example of the many lapses that exist in our constitution. States
should be the one to raise taxes. But this issue is one of the issues
we will definitely take up. The most important thing is for members of
the House to hold the interest of their states foremost. That is
paramount. About minimum wage, where will the states get money to pay
if the federal government is collecting all the taxes? I think this
issue may end up being resolved by the judiciary.

The quality of
support staff for federal legislators has been reportedly poor. It is
said that fund meant to hiring quality staff end up in the pockets of
legislators.

Do you see this as a big issue that will eventually affect the quality of legislation the country enjoys?

Money meant for
legislative staff does not end up in legislators’ pocket. It is paid
directly to the staff by the National Assembly Service Commission. I
don’t pay a single member of my staff. But let me agree with you that
the quality of legislative staff needs to be seriously considered. In
the US, after which we modelled our democracy, if you are not from an
Ivy League university, your chances of working for a legislator are
very slim. So they have the best hands and they therefore get the best
results. In Nigeria, most of us end up employing people who have run
our campaigns for us and who do not even have an idea of legislative
business. So, there has to be a legislation that will standardise the
level and capacity of legislative staff. I don’t know why a legislator
cannot employ a lawyer or an accountant who will be well paid.

Will you be pushing for such a legislation?

Yes. It has to be
done either by legislation or regulation for us to have better output.
And I think there is a standard defined under the civil service rule.
May be an enforcement of that standard is what we need.

The Speaker, Dimeji Bankole, is not coming back to the House. What is your relationship with him?

He is a personal
friend and we will remain friends. He is a good man. He has been
magnanimous in defeat. And I think Nigerians appreciate that. He is
young and I am sure he will continue to be relevant to Nigeria’s
development.

What are you going to miss about him?

I have so many
colleagues that are not coming back, both from ACN and other parties. I
know I’m going to miss them but what exactly I will miss is what I
haven’t really thought about.

What is your assessment of the national assembly election?

It went well but I
won’t be one of those who will start rejoicing that it is perfect.
First, the standard has been set so low that any little improvement,
which is what we have now, becomes so big. But compared with what
obtains in advanced democracies, we are not yet there. A lot more has
to be done.

Opposition
parties in Lagos have alleged several irregularities said to be
perpetrated by the ACN. Will you say ACN also benefitted from our
imperfect electoral conduct?

It is a cultural
thing for Nigerians to cry foul where there is none. If you lose, you
are rigged out. If you allege, then bring the evidence. Camera phones
were allowed to monitor the election. I will be glad if they can
provide evidence.

There is a
new fear that some people who won election on ACN’s platform will
defect to PDP. Is there a structure or strategy to prevent that?

At the end of the
day, this is something that may resort to lawsuits. The fear is there.
We tried to prevent that during the last constitutional amendment by
proposing that cross-carpeting be banned outrightly. But the PDP argued
otherwise. They said everyone has freedom of association, which I don’t
think is an absolute freedom. But I think it is high time the people
woke up and began to use the power of recall, which they have under the
constitution.

What is
your reaction to the belief that Governor Fashola’s sterling
performance is a boost to the chances of other ACN contestants in Lagos?

Without taking away
anything from Fashola, who has done very well, I must say that there
were ACN elective office holders in Lagos before Fashola came on board.
It is not like another party was holding sway before Fashola came.

But the local councils have not received the same admiration that Fashola has got.

I have to agree
with you that the local governments’ structure is complex and
inefficient but that is not peculiar to Lagos alone. It may be a
constitutional issue or lack of fund, I don’t know. I think a local
government conference needs to be called so can they analyse their
problems and proffer solutions. But local governments must be up and
doing because they made my campaign very difficult. People do not know
the job of a legislator yet, so when I go for campaign, people complain
about their roads, gutters, etc. Those are not my job but how do I
explain that to them? So I have to accept the responsibility.

The issue of legislators’ allowances will not go away. Do you think it is deserving or should it be reduced?

First, let me say
again that there is no such thing as constituency allowance. And
journalists should know if they do their work. There was a day the
finance minister came to the floor of the House and one of my
colleagues asked the minister to clarify the issue of constituency
allowance in the presence of the media. The minister said he has heard
about it but that there is actually no such thing. I told my colleagues
that I was ready to bet my last kobo that no newspaper would carry such
vital information. The next day, I bought about 10 newspapers and none
carried it. Our allowances have been compared with those of legislators
in other climes. But I always say that I would rather be an American
legislator and keep all of my money than a Nigerian legislator who ends
up spending most of his earnings on constituents. American legislators
do not do poverty eradication programme. They do not sink boreholes,
construct roads, pay school fees, buy motorcycles or sewing machines.
Nigerian legislators do all of these. So, there is no basis for
comparison. Everybody in your constituency as a Nigerian legislator
comes to you for one problem or the other and you have to meet their
needs. On the other hand, everybody in the executive government also
has allowances, which is the running cost of their offices. We do not
regard such allowance as part of their take home pay but we do that for
legislators. So, when the CBN (Central Bank of Nigeria) governor said
the national assembly spends 25 percent of national budget, which is
totally wrong, we failed to ask where the remaining 75 percent goes. If
we truly want to stop the economy from bleeding, we have to look at all
arms of government and not single out the legislature.

But doesn’t the legislature have the oversight function of stopping the bleeding?

Well, we know where
the 75 percent is going but journalists will not look at issues
holistically. It is no secret. How do you oversee the 75 percent when
the 25 percent they are selling to you is even wrong? CBN’s budget,
which is just an agency out of so many agencies of the executive
government, is even more than the budget of the national assembly,
which is an arm of the government, by 100 percent. How much is the
allowance of the CBN governor? How much is his travel and hotel
allowance? We should look into all that.

But don’t you think the national assembly could have prevented this attack if it had been proactive in its oversight function?

We have saved so
much money for the country that is not even reported, money that could
have ended up in pockets of some political appointees of government.
So, if the motivation is to help the country rather than vilify a set
of people, we should look at everything holistically. You would be
shocked to know where the economy bleeds most.

What influence does Bola Tinubu have on you?

He is somebody I
have learnt a lot from and I continue to learn from the great man.
Fashola, who we all acclaim, has also learnt a lot from Tinubu. Don’t
forget he was Tinubu’s chief of staff.

People say that godfathers make overbearing demands.

I haven’t had that experience. A couple of times, he (Tinubu) has
made his position known about issues being discussed on the floor (of
the House). But, honestly, he doesn’t ram it down your neck. He just
states his own opinion. We look at issues and debate. Frankly, nine
times out of 10, he has a more compelling argument. He is a very
intelligent man. He was a legislator and a governor, so he is more
experienced and sees things from a better angle.